What does fiduciary duty actually require when you own the whole economy? Madison Condon, Associate Professor at Boston University School of Law and recipient of the American Law Institute's Early Career Scholars Medal, brings one of the most rigorous legal and economic frameworks in climate finance to the Future of Finance podcast.

For institutional investors, pension funds, endowments, and sovereign wealth funds, climate change is not a values question. It is a portfolio-level structural exposure. When damages from fossil fuel companies cascade through every other holding in a diversified portfolio, the conventional logic of ESG as a screened strategy breaks down. What replaces it is a systems-level argument grounded in fiduciary law, macroeconomic modeling, and the economics of universal ownership.

Topics covered in this episode:

• The legal basis for climate action under fiduciary duty, including the Uniform Prudent Investor Act and the duty of impartiality toward future beneficiaries
• Why leading macroeconomic climate models have systematically underestimated damages and what better modeling looks like
• The diverging interests of asset owners and asset managers, and why that distinction is increasingly consequential
• The McRitchie v. Zuckerberg decision and what Delaware corporate law says about externalities and diversified shareholders
• The Texas v. BlackRock antitrust case and the emerging legal risk landscape for climate-aligned investor coalitions
• The role of IEA scenarios and institutions like NCAR in shaping capital allocation and why their integrity matters to investors

Future of Finance is produced by the Intentional Endowments Network. New episodes explore how institutional capital can be aligned with long-term economic resilience.

Resources Mentioned:

https://share.google/QGtJ3a2aIQpfIR7SM

General Timestamps:

00:00 Introduction — Universal Ownership and Systemic Climate Risk

03:15 The 2020 Paper: Externalities and the Common Owner

07:10 Asset Owners vs. Asset Managers — Why the Distinction Matters

10:20 Fiduciary Duty and the Legal Landscape for Climate Action

13:30 The Duty of Impartiality and Future Beneficiaries

16:40 Corporate vs. Portfolio Fiduciary Duties — The Delaware Question

23:10 Why Climate Economic Models Have Underpriced Risk

28:30 Supply Chain Bottlenecks and Place-Based Climate Impacts

32:50 Antitrust Risk and the Texas v. BlackRock Case

38:20 Investor Policy Engagement and the Role of Climate Data Institutions

43:00 IEA Scenarios as a Self-Fulfilling Mechanism in Capital Markets

47:30 Vision for the Future — Asset Owner Governance and Long-Term Capital

Fran Seegull, President of the U.S. Impact Investing Alliance, joins host Georges Dyer for a wide-ranging conversation on the structural forces reshaping institutional investing. Before leading the Alliance, which she co-founded with Darren Walker of the Ford Foundation, Fran served as Chief Investment Officer of ImpactAssets, overseeing its $3 billion impact investing donor-advised fund, and taught graduate-level impact investing at USC's Marshall School of Business.

For institutional investors, this conversation arrives at a critical juncture. The policy and governance environment is actively constraining the tools investors need to manage systemic risk: from anti-ESG legislation restricting fiduciary discretion, to executive actions targeting community finance infrastructure, to the erosion of shareholder engagement rights. At the same time, frameworks like system-level investing and dynamic materiality are gaining traction as rigorous, financially-grounded responses to risks that traditional portfolio theory was not built to handle.

Topics covered in this episode:

• The U.S. Impact Investing Alliance: mission, structure, and four-pillar strategy
• System-level investing as a bridge between traditional finance and impact frameworks
• Capital markets assumptions and how systemic factors should be priced
• Double materiality and dynamic materiality (definitions, distinctions, and investment implications)
• The Community Reinvestment Act and CDFI ecosystem: importance, recent threats, and bipartisan defense
• Anti-ESG legislation: the financial case against it and the first major constitutional challenge
• The rise of corporate management primacy and the erosion of shareholder accountability tools
• Impact measurement frameworks, verification tools, and the IEN Endowment Impact Benchmark
• Final takes: what every institutional investor should do today, and Fran's vision for the future of finance

Essential listening for CIOs, pension trustees, endowment leaders, and policy professionals navigating the evolving intersection of fiduciary duty, systemic risk, and long-term capital markets stability.

Resources Mentioned:

Beyond Modern Portfolio Theory - https://share.google/0HU0Sfshhzw9ANysL

Principles Responsible Investing Podcast - https://www.unpri.org/newsroom/podcasts

General Timestamps:

00:00 Introduction & Guest Background

02:00 What the U.S. Impact Investing Alliance Does — and How It Came to Be

07:30 Global Context: Where the U.S. Stands in the Impact Investing World

09:00 Is Impact Investing Fit for Purpose? The Case for System Transformation

17:00 System-Level Investing: Non-Diversifiable Risk and the Full Toolkit

22:00 Capital Markets Assumptions, Double Materiality, and Dynamic Materiality

29:30 Community Investing: The CRA, CDFIs, and the Defense of Financial Infrastructure

41:30 The Freedom to Invest: Anti-ESG Legislation and the First Constitutional Win

47:30 Climate Policy Rollback: Market Forces vs. Federal Headwinds

50:00 Impact Measurement: From Transparency to Accountability

54:00 The Rise of Corporate Management Primacy — A New Governance Risk

1:00:00 Final Takes: One Action for Every Institutional Investor

Systemic climate risk is increasingly recognized across capital markets but how should institutional investors engage with the policy drivers shaping that risk?

In this episode of the Future of Finance podcast, host Georges Dyer speaks with Richard Roberts, Inquiry Lead at Volans, about the intersection of systemic risk, fiduciary duty, and investor engagement on real-economy climate policy.

For long-horizon asset owners, disclosure frameworks alone may not address the structural economic forces influencing portfolio outcomes. Energy systems, infrastructure policy, industrial strategy, and trade dynamics ultimately determine emissions pathways and market stability.

Key themes include:

• The imbalance between disclosure-focused engagement and real-economy policy
• Systemic risk across diversified portfolios
• Catastrophic risk and the limits of economic modeling
• Coalition-based approaches to policy engagement
• Governance structures and long-term stewardship incentives

For CIOs, trustees, and policy leaders, the conversation explores whether policy engagement is becoming a necessary dimension of systemic stewardship.

Resources Mentioned:

Recalibrating Carbon Risk: https://carbontracker.org/reports/recalibrating-climate-risk/

Triple Bottom Line Harvard Business Review: https://hbr.org/2018/06/25-years-ago-i-coined-the-phrase-triple-bottom-line-heres-why-im-giving-up-on-it

Existential Politics - Jessica F. Green: https://share.google/RLMhxwaxpSnWvhqAj

Timestamps:

00:00 Introduction

03:10 Disclosure vs. Real-Economy Policy

08:00 Investor Resource Allocation Findings

14:20 Political Legitimacy and Engagement Constraints

19:40 Coalition Strategies and Collective Action

26:35 Fiduciary Duty and Systemic Risk

32:10 Catastrophic Risk and Tipping Points

47:45 A Long-Term Vision for Finance

Climate change is not only an environmental issue but a capital markets risk management challenge.

In this episode of the Future of Finance podcast, Georges Dyer speaks with Bob Litterman, former Partner and Head of Risk Management at Goldman Sachs and Chair of the CFTC Climate-Related Market Risk Subcommittee. Bob shares why climate change should be understood through the lens of systemic risk, incentives, and pricing distortions.

This conversation examines what climate risk means for institutional investors, sovereign competitiveness, and long-duration capital allocation.

Key themes include:

• Physical vs. transition risk from a portfolio perspective
• Why carbon pricing corrects a structural market failure
• The role of carbon border adjustment mechanisms
• Global fossil fuel subsidies and capital misallocation
• Financial regulatory frameworks for climate risk
• The evolution of carbon accounting and compliance markets

For CIOs, trustees, asset managers, and policy leaders, this discussion explores how incentive structures shape capital flows and how markets may reprice climate risk faster than expected.

00:00 Introduction and Background

02:47 Climate Risk as a Risk Management Problem

05:41 Physical vs. Transition Risk

09:52 Why Carbon Pricing Is Foundational

14:22 Political Economy of Carbon Taxes

18:17 Investment Gaps in the Low-Carbon Transition

21:30 Carbon Accounting and Embedded Emissions

27:58 CFTC Climate Risk Report and Financial System Implications

35:04 Extreme Weather and Financial Stability

50:51 Vision for the Future of Finance

Resources Bob mentions: MANAGING CLIMATE RISK IN THE U.S. FINANCIAL SYSTEM | Report of the Climate-Related Market Risk Subcommittee, Market Risk Advisory Committee of the U.S. Commodity Futures Trading Commission

REPORT TO THE PRESIDENT Extreme Weather Risk in a Changing Climate: Enhancing prediction and protecting communities

What role should investors play in addressing systemic risks like climate change, inequality, and biodiversity loss?

In this episode of the Future of Finance podcast, we speak with Caroline Flammer, Director of the Sustainable Investing Research Initiative (SIRI) at Columbia University, about system-level investing, fiduciary duty, and the limits of modern portfolio theory.

What we cover:

• Why systemic risks should be treated as endogenous, not exogenous
• The evolving interpretation of fiduciary duty
• How government inaction shifts responsibility to investors
• The role of blended finance in emerging markets
• Why risk perception may be limiting capital flows

🎧 Available on YouTube and all major podcast platforms: https://pod.link/1793610181

Links to resources Caroline mentioned:

• Scaling Sustainable Investing in Emerging and Developing Economies: Frictions and Opportunities: https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=6088507
• The Moskowitz Prize paper: https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=4770779
• SIRI’s Blended Finance program: https://siri.sipa.columbia.edu/content/blended-finance
• SIRI’s Pathways to Consensus program: https://siri.sipa.columbia.edu/content/pathways-consensus

#systemlevelinvesting #sustainableinvestingresearch #blendedfinance #emergingmarkets #columbiauniversity #impactinvesting #finance #climaterisk #endogenous #futureoffinance #futureoffinancepodcast

Modern finance typically optimizes profit, but not human well-being. Investor and author Jenna Nicholas explains why that’s a problem, and how we can fix it.

In this episode of The Future of Finance Podcast, George Dyer sits down with Jenna Nicholas, President of LightPost Capital and author of Enlightened Bottom Line.

They explore:

• Why GDP and profit fail to measure human flourishing
• How spirituality, purpose, and finance intersect
• The HEAL framework: Hope, Empathy, Abundance, and Legacy
• Why money is “stored energy” that must circulate
• How responsible AI could reshape investing
• What today’s students and young professionals need to know about the future of finance

This conversation challenges the idea that maximizing returns alone leads to better outcomes, and offers a more human, long-term vision for capitalism, investing, and leadership.

🎧 Watch on YouTube: https://youtu.be/07v2WO5fTdE

📘 Enlightened Bottom Line by Jenna Nicholas: https://www.jenna-nicholas.com/book

Keywords: spirituality, impact investing, HEAL framework, Baha'i faith, sustainability, abundance, empathy, legacy, conscious capitalism, financial equity

In this episode of Future of Finance, Georges Dyer speaks with Mike Kubzansky, CEO of Omidyar Network, about how investors can actively engage with AI risks and opportunities to ensure technology serves broad societal benefit rather than concentrating power and prosperity among a few.

Kubzansky explains how Omidyar Network—founded over 20 years ago by eBay's Pierre Omidyar—uses investments, grants, and advocacy to "bend the arc of the digital revolution" toward broadly shared prosperity. With nearly three-quarters of a billion dollars deployed across early-stage startups, funds, and policy work, the organization focuses on building intentional governance structures around emerging technologies, much like society learned to regulate automobiles and biomedicine.

The conversation centers on practical strategies for investors looking to address AI-related risks in their portfolios. Kubzansky shares concrete guidance on how to work with external managers and portfolio companies to build trust, reduce harm, and create accountability around AI deployment. He emphasizes that technology doesn't govern itself—deliberate societal choices are required to capture benefits while minimizing risks.

Kubzansky also offers career advice for impact-oriented professionals, encouraging them not to bypass traditional finance roles at institutions like Goldman Sachs or CalPERS. Building core technical skills first, he argues, creates more effective impact practitioners later—as long as they maintain their moral compass and view these roles as developmental stops rather than final destinations.

Ultimately, the episode underscores how investors at every level can play a critical role in shaping responsible AI development through thoughtful engagement, governance, and strategic capital allocation.

Podcast: Odd Lots https://www.bloomberg.com/oddlots Podcast: Tech Policy Press https://www.techpolicy.press/podcast/ Substack: Garrison Lovely https://substack.com/@garrisonlovely Substack: Jasmine Sun https://substack.com/@jasmine

Book: Power and Progress, by Acemoglu and Johnson https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/62315566-power-and-progress?ref=nav_sb_ss_1_27 Book: Carlota Perez: Technological Revolutions and Financial Capital https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/60509.Technological_Revolutions_and_Financial_Capital

RailPen’s principles: https://www.railpen.com/news/2025/railpen-launches-new-framework-to-help-investors-and-companies-effectively-oversee-ai-related-risks/ Edelman Trust Barometer: https://www.edelman.com/trust/2025/trust-barometer/flash-poll-trust-artifical-intelligence AIAT Report on the market and market size for AI Assurance Tech: https://www.aiat.report/

Keywords: Responsible AI, AI governance, Tech policy, Digital revolution, Impact investing, Philanthropy, ESG investing, Technology regulation, Societal governance, Shared prosperity

In this episode of Future of Finance, Georges Dyer is joined by Gaurab Bansal, Executive Director of Responsible Innovation Labs (RIL), to explore how startups and investors can embed responsible AI practices early—before harmful externalities become costly and difficult to unwind.

Bansal shares how RIL works with early-stage founders to integrate governance, risk awareness, and values into company culture while still prioritizing survival, growth, and commercial success. Rather than treating responsibility as a compliance exercise, he argues that responsible innovation is fundamentally a business strategy—one that leads to better products, stronger trust with customers, and improved long-term performance.

The conversation spans key AI-driven risks and opportunities, including workforce disruption, energy and climate impacts, misinformation, and social cohesion. Bansal also discusses the critical role investors—especially LPs and GPs—can play by incorporating downside risk and responsibility considerations into diligence, governance, and engagement with portfolio companies.

Ultimately, the episode highlights why the greatest leverage point for shaping the future of AI may lie with startups and early-stage capital—and how building good habits, governance, and decision-making frameworks from day one can help ensure technology advances human flourishing rather than undermining it.

This episode was brought to you by Metis Global Partners.

Keywords:

Responsible AI, Responsible Innovation Labs, Startup governance, Venture capital engagement, AI risk management, Workforce disruption, Technology externalities, Sustainable investing, LP–GP stewardship, Human-centered technology