It's Jordan's turn to host and he's got some AI companies he's not sure about...

Timestamps:

• (00:06) - Jordan's episode to host!
• (01:19) - Business update from Brian
• (05:45) - Justin's business update
• (14:09) - How Jordan advertises to his existing customers
• (21:50) - Jordan's business update
• (28:48) - Is Polsia fake or real?
• (40:47) - Adam Wathan announces ui.sh
• (58:12) - Is Delve AI compliance a scam?
• (01:14:45) - Where is OpenClaw today and what's the point?

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Links mentioned in this episode:

• GStack — Turn Claude Code into a Virtual Software Development Team
• Polsia — AI That Runs Your Company While You Sleep
• This AI generates $689K - Business Podcast for Startups
• ui.sh — Turn your terminal into a design engineer
• Stitch - Design with AI
• Basecamp — Basecamp CLI and Agent Skill: Agent first, agent native
• Delve | SOC 2 Compliance, HIPAA | Automated Compliance for AI, Startups | Get GDPR, ISO 27001, Cybersecurity Compliant & More | Delve Automated Compliance
• Delve - Fake Compliance as a Service - Part I
• Gusto | Online HR Services: Payroll, Benefits and everything else
• OpenClaw AI - Open Source AI Assistant | Formerly Clawdbot & Moltbot
• Claude

Brian, Justin, and Jordan talk about the opportunity costs in business decision-making, the impact of AI on marketing channels and strategies, and building custom internal tools with AI versus SaaS solutions.

Timestamps:

• (00:44) - Brian takes the lead
• (02:17) - Opportunity costs
• (17:29) - What is Brian's opportunity on Twitter?
• (21:41) - Figuring out what Builder Methods is and who it's for
• (24:53) - Should Brian hire someone to help achieve his goal?
• (28:47) - How is AI killing Saas
• (39:54) - People will want their own agent to use the softare, not a company's AI
• (51:07) - Jordan's CRM experiment

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Links:

• Builder Methods Pro
• Brian's YouTube

What happened to you in Mexico? Justin is back from his co-founder retreat with Jon on Holbox Island. He gets vulnerable about the drift that naturally happens in a remote co-founder relationship, the big conversations they'd been avoiding, and the realization that alignment isn't a one-time thing (it requires constant investment!). Jordan and Brian weigh in on co-founder dynamics, decision-making in a 50/50 partnership, and why strategy has to belong to a key decision maker.

The conversation then spills into the "Mexican standoff" happening on teams as AI reshapes who does what and whether that's something to fear (or lean into).

Timestamps:

• (00:06) - Introduction
• (01:47) - Justin and Jon's founder retreat
• (06:44) - Using video as an example of how to communicate with cofounders
• (09:45) - It's not a marriage, it's a dictatorship
• (12:12) - What do goals look like for a company?
• (20:48) - Video is hard and heavy... should we do it?
• (24:22) - What Jordan's done to help alignment on his team
• (29:46) - What about Jon's side of the conversation?
• (39:46) - Navigating new work dynamics with the speed of AI
• (46:56) - There are smart developers resisting AI - why?
• (54:24) - A Mexican standoff on teams
• (01:06:47) - Company design and system design

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Links mentioned in this episode:

• Holbox Island
• Photos from co-founder retreat
• Article: The five stages of losing our craft
• Article: Will Claude Code ruin our team?
• Jack Dorsey lays off 931 workers
• Polsia - this weird AI driven SaaS making $2m! (You give it an idea, provide a budget/credit card, and it autonomously launches the business)
• More on Ben Cera, founder of Polsia
• The Amazing Money Machine book cover

Brian and Jordan talk about the need for developers to adapt to survive, Brian debates how much of a content creator he is vs product seller, Jordan relates his experience talking with investors, and the rise of zero human companies ZHC.

Timestamps:

• (00:18) - Welcoming Justin er Jordan back to the show
• (02:48) - Companies that we're surprised aren't adopting AI tools
• (11:49) - Roles are blending together
• (20:18) - Is Brian a product person or creator?
• (33:36) - Or should he be doing consulting?
• (37:27) - Debating taking funding for Saas
• (48:10) - Zero Human Companies

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Links mentioned in this episode:

• Matt Pocock on X: "Something that I think goes under-emphasized is how much AI coding demands a 'lead dev' mentality. If you spent your pre-AI career trying to level up your teammates (through API design, feedback loops, architecture) Then working with AI will feel natural. If you only focused"
• Extend Claude with skills - Claude Code Docs
• About - Gauntlet AI
• Austen Allred on X: "Kelly (my AI bot) used 5 subagents to one-shot this app end to end. Zero human involvement. Insane. She’s building App Store worthy apps entirely by herself on the daily now."
• Tom Osman 🐦‍⬛ on X: "I work on the assumption that the most powerful AI models are far more intelligent than me. My job is just to assist when needed. This morning I gave @JunoAgent a Deep Research model to explore different token design routes based on what we're working on. This came out 👇🏻"

We make 2 big announcements about changes to The Panel. Then we debate whether there's a founder branding advantage and how AI will affect small software teams in 2026.

Timestamps:

• (00:46) - Our first announcement
• (02:20) - Why are we bringing Jordan on as a co-host?
• (06:51) - Why did Jordan want to join The Panel?
• (14:48) - What's the new format for The Panel?
• (18:29) - Is there a founder branding advantage?
• (37:03) - How is AI going to affect Saas in 2026 and beyond?
• (43:32) - How small teams can adapt easier than larger teams to AI

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Links mentioned in this episode:

• Bootstrapped Web
• Marketing for Developers
• A Mexican standoff Happening in AI
• The five stages of losing our craft
• Justin is the co-founder of Transistor.fm
• Brian is the founder of Builder Methods
• Jordan is the co-founder of Rosie

Important: we're no longer livestreaming on Justin's personal YouTube channel. Make sure you're subscribed to ​The Panel's channel​ to get notified when we go live:

Subscribe to The Panel YouTube here -->

Join us FRIDAY (tomorrow, Feb 20) at 11 AM Pacific (2 pm EST) for a surprise announcement:
https://www.youtube.com/live/sxASjnzAYkw

We'll be announcing:
- A new ███████ ██████ ████
- And a brand new ████ ███████
- New livestream/recording time: Friday, 11 am Pacific
- Livestreams will now be streamed from ​The Panel YT channel​, not Justin's personal channel

Brian and Justin jump off Matt Shumer's "Something Big is Happening" article to ask questions like is something big happening in AI that even regular folks need to be preparing for? Is this the most important year of your work as a software developer? Should you be getting your financial house in order to prepare for what's about to hit us all?

Timestamps:

• (00:12) - Sick snow
• (02:46) - Something big is happening here (AI edition)
• (21:02) - Not having to be held down by legacy code speeds you up
• (28:36) - Warnings to the non-technical world about AI
• (45:35) - Humans have a hard time assessing their field of view in the future
• (48:55) - This might be the most important year of your work
• (51:12) - AI in education with kids
• (56:05) - Seeing the world the way it is vs the way it was
• (58:23) - Getting your financial house in order
• (01:04:14) - The job market and the economy
• (01:13:00) - Sometimes you have to play the game not on the field

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Links mentioned in this episode:

• Justin's snowboard adventure in Revelstoke
• "Something Big is Happening" – The viral Matt Shumer article (76M views)
• Matt Shumer's blog
• Matt Shumer's company (HyperWrite)
• "Tool Shaped Objects" – The response to Shumer's post
• Justin's new RSS feed
• Builder Methods video library (Claude Code course)
• Moneyball: "Adapt or die" clip
• Justin's post on XSLT going away

Come meet the crew of AI agents Brian has working for him, Justin's building fake apps to experiment and find out what he wants for real apps, and why don't we feel like we can relax now that we're doing ok?

Timestamps:

• (00:45) - What we're talking about this episode
• (03:14) - Brian's OpenClaw setup
• (11:57) - The cost of token usage with OpenClaw
• (17:32) - What makes the memory better in OpenClaw?
• (22:38) - What about Cowork?
• (25:21) - Working with multiple agents in OpenClaw
• (27:07) - The problem of Siri
• (29:25) - The challenges of working is the same across AI or hiring
• (31:28) - The importance of thinking of AI as an employee
• (35:03) - What you'll miss by using AI instead of hiring a human
• (44:14) - Why Justin thinks it's important to build fake products
• (49:57) - Justin's app to publish a video as a podcast
• (53:41) - Building a company to compete with yourself like Freshbooks
• (55:39) - How might Transistor change bringing in new features?
• (01:04:07) - Design OS updates
• (01:09:01) - Why is Brian working all the time and feeling urgency?
• (01:16:26) - Marketing for developers in 2026
• (01:30:37) - Founder led marketing is key
• (01:36:27) - Where are the real products being built with AI? Is AI actually speeding me up?
• (01:46:31) - Do I need to make as much money as possible now?

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Links mentioned in this episode:

• OpenClaw (Clawdbot)
• Brian’s crew of AI agents that live on his Mac Mini
• OpenClaw popularity on GitHub over time
• Demo of Justin’s video hosting app
• The story of how Freshbooks created a fake company to launch a new version of their product
• Caleb Porzio - Everything I feel about AI right now
• Jeffrey Way - I'm done
• Adam Wathan - ui.sh